Timer with a scene based condition (status question)

[Anonymous]

#40265

I have a timer setup (Night Time OFF) that I want to setup to turn off a scene (Night Scene) based on two conditions. First, I would like it to be an absolute time based (00:30 every day). Second, I would like it to ONLY happen if another scene (Party Scene) is OFF.

I have tried the following:

Trial 1: WORKS
Condition: Absolute Time = 00:30, MTWHFSS

Trial 2: DOES NOT WORK
Condition 1: Absolute Time = 00:30, MTWHFSS
AND
Condition 2: Party Scene status = 00, MTWHFSS

Trial 3: DOES NOT WORK
Condition 1: Absolute Time = 00:30, MTWHFSS
AND
Condition 2: Party Scene status = 13, MTWHFSS

Trial 4: DOES NOT WORK
Condition 1: Absolute Time = 00:30 + Party Scene status = 1303 (EZServe Party Scene is on Unit 03), MTWHFSS

In all trial’s I enter the condition, press save, press back, press save.

I have telnet’ed into the system to monitor the status and nothing happens at the scheduled time (with the exception of Trial 1, which works correctly).

Any suggestions/help would be appreciated. Thanks,
Steve

[Anonymous]

#43391

I don’t think you can condition on “Scene” status. Insteon does not track Scene status. The Smarthome SmartLinc deals with this by allowing a specific device in the scene to represent whether the entire scene is on or off. The SmarLinc does not have the capability of Actions which allow selecting specific devices. Pick a device for the Condition check. The status checked depends on whether the device was turned On/Off with a Value=FF/0 or an Insteon Group On/Off from a button press or another device. I have a KeypadLinc that is controlled with a Motion Sensor and an Action. This granularity allows the Action to condition effects on whether the KeypadLinc was last controlled by the Motion Sensor, a button press or an Action. The following conditions are from an Action that checks if the KeypadLinc was turned Off by an Action (AttrVal=”0x00″) or a KeypadLinc button press (AttrVal=”0x1301″). The Conditions are evaluated in this definition as (Condition 1 And Condition 2) Or (Condition 3 And Condition 4).

[Anonymous]

#43392

So based on your statement I tried the following without any success:

Trial 1: Not Working
Condition 1: Absolute Time = 13:01, MTWHFSS
Condition 2: Entry KL status = 1303 (3rd button on the Entry KPL), MTWHFSS

Trial 2: Not Working
Condition 1: Absolute Time = 13:07, MTWHFSS
Condition 2: Entry KL status = 0003 (3rd button on the Entry KPL), MTWHFSS

BTW: I use the HTML interface and that is why I am providing the codes this way and not the actual HEX values.

What I find odd is that at the given time, I don’t even see the EZServe polling the Entry KL device to see if its button 03 is ON/OFF. Should it?

I am also using bin version 02.06.04 PLM version 63 (if it matters).

Thanks,
Steve

[Anonymous]

#43393

You cannot check the status of a secondary KPL button. EZSrve is using the status it last saw for the device in question, not querying the actual device. You need to check one of the devices being controlled by the secondary KPL button, not the KPL button itself.

[Anonymous]

#43394

That really doesn’t work because there are no devices in my house that are dedicated to “Party Scene” to know that it is party time.

Back to a point you made earlier, when you hover over the status value column in the Condition it states that you can base it on a scene. So using “Party Scene” should be able to work based on the interface. The question is, what is the combination of settings necessary to determine whether the scene is ON or OFF?

Any thoughts on this? Thanks,
Steve

[Anonymous]

#43395

I do not think you can condition on the state of a scene. However, I will set up a test here to verify that. It would not be the first time I was wrong about something.

That said, the way I handle the situation where no individual device can be used to represent the scene state, is to use a dummy X10 address. Define an X10 address that is not on the network. Define a pair of Actions that are triggered by the secondary KPL button press On/Off (if they do not already exist) with effects that turn On/Off the dummy X10 address. It makes no difference that the X10 address does not exist on the network. Then use the state of the dummy X10 device, On (2) or Off (3), to determine if the scene controlled by the secondary KPL button is On or Off. I’ve used this technique several times before to handle the situation you describe.

It will take a few hours (maybe a day with the holiday) to set up a Scene driven by a secondary KPL button to verify what can and cannot be done regarding conditions.

EDIT: I checked the words on the popup help and you are correct. It does say Scene. However, I don’t think it means Scene in your context. Smarthome uses the word Scene in its sales information presumably because Scene is better understood than Group. A Scene is really a Group and often the terms are used interchangeably. If one would look at the Smartlabs Insteon commands document or the PLM developer user guide you will not find the word Scene anywhere, as there is no such thing as a Scene per say. It is a Group. Internally all Insteon knows about are Groups. The hex values that are listed in the popup help are Group information; Group number, Group command (actually same a device command), reflecting Group messages sent by a given device or received by a given device. I do not think EZSrve tracks “Scenes” as no such thing actually exists in the Insteon architecture, they are Groups. I will do the tests I indicated before.

[Anonymous]

#43396

Thanks grif, anything that you can do to help would be appreciated. For now… I just won’t have any parties! 😛

Have a great weekend.
Steve

[Anonymous]

#43397

II was able to define an Action that triggered with a combination of Absolute=Anded with Scene SPartyScene Status FF. I initially turned Scene SPartyScene On with an Action Effect SPartyScene Status FF that ran with an Absolute= time about 20 minutes before the Action with the 2 Conditions Anded together.

I followed that with another Action that turned the Scene Off with an Effect SPartyScene Status 00 at an Absolute= time. That was followed by a 4th Action that has 2 Conditions Anded together, Absolute= Anded with SPartyScene Status 00 which runs only if the Scene is Off. This Action also ran as defined.

[Anonymous]

#43398

If you are not able to get the Action to trigger, post both the Action xml that is turning Off the Scene and the Action xml that should trigger on time and Scene Off. The Action xml file is created whether defining Actions with the HTML or the Harmony client.

[Anonymous]

#43399

For the benefit of others who review this topic, a Scene that EZSrve creates which has EZServe as the Controller can be used in Action Conditions. A Scene that EZSrve creates where some other device is the Controller, such as a KeypadLinc button or SwitchLinc paddle being the Controller, this type of Scene cannot be used in Action Conditions. This type of Scene will not appear in the selection list of choices for a Condition Device.

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